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Deportivo Discuss Real Club Deportivo de La Coruña here: its history, matches, Riazor etc.

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Old 07-11-2003, 21:51   #1
George Mitsou
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Default Immediate transfer needs

I really have deep respect for this forum's policy so I'm having a difficult time controlling my feelings when I read about Mr Lendoiro's "dreams" about winning in the Primera and the CL, or watching him behaving "exceptionally presidential" in Camp Nou beside Laporta. We can't have it bothways, Mr President, can we? Keeping budget as low as possible and, on the other hand, challenging all existing titles. The simple truth, my friends, is that, with these human resources, this team is:
1. OVERACHIEVING and
2. FIGHTING ALONE.
Last season, in the end, my heart broke watching Depor suffering from injuries and out-of-shape players, having to use 41 years old Donato... It would be an ugly joke if it wasn't true. What a pity that title was lost...
This summer, I couldn't believe my eyes reading in papers about Makay's transfer due to "financial problems" (selling Makay for a good price could make sense, not dealing with the squad's weaknesses again and again doesn't). What "financial problems"? Why "financial problems"? For a team challenging the PD and participating in CL for years? Are we talking dividents demands here? Or maybe the income from marketing, sponsoring and TV rights are still not competitive enough? If that's the case, administration is simply not doing its job.
Meanwhile, Irureta functions as a magician. Fran is getting old so he transforms Luque to an extraordinary AML. He makes Capdevila and Scaloni capable of playing 2-3 positions either. Most of all, he lacks pace and stamina in midfield (with hard working yet poor defending Sergio and 36 years old Mauro giving all he's got - Duscher is unlikely a reliable option, at least so far) so he pushes forward the defencing line, to reduce opponents' space. He also works with its coordination so as to deploy the offside trap. But this is risky. It worked against Barca (always on the edge though), it failed against excellent in "reading the game", highly talented, speedy and anticipating Jiouly, especially because Naybet's concentration was below zero. Finally, he always protects his players in the media, obviously because some of them cannot handle the pressure. Protect who? International yet technically inadequate and permanently insecure M. Pablo, reacting like an amateur in 1st goal? Or highly experienced Naybet, failing to mark Prso during a corner kicK(!), losing Jiouly throughout the match?
But enough with Irureta's magic and enough is enough, anyway. Depor needs immediately:
1. A competitive, pacey DMC, with good defending, organising and leadership skills.
2. A solid, pacey DC (not to mention a reliable, in defending duties at least, DR).
These needs are yesterday's news for me. Would they be covered, this team could make a difference. Deportivo does not deserve humiliation. In any case, it definetely deserves more support and protection from its administration.

(I apologise in advance for the "lengthy essay" as Affizlesomething-whatever would say -and would probably be right. Thank you for your time...)
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Old 07-11-2003, 23:25   #2
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Default Re: Immediate transfer needs

Incredible post, congratulations
One of my doubt for the future of Depor is the "new blood in the team" Who will be the replacements for players like Naybet, Mauro and Fran when they go out of the squad? when Depor will use young men in the 1st. team? Madrid have Portillo and Raúl; Atlético have Torres; Barca have Puyol...and we?
In the other hand we have good players in every position on the field and that's our key weapon to face all the competitions but, sometimes they are tired and "out of concentration" in the games and then it's when we loose like Wednesday night. I don't know if this problem will be solve with "star players" the experience of Barca, Betis, Inter and Lazio tell me that a million squad isn't in all the opportunities a "machine of titles".

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Originally Posted by George Mitsou
...so he pushes forward the defencing line, to reduce opponents' space. He also works with its coordination so as to deploy the offside trap. But this is risky. It worked against Barca (always on the edge though), it failed against excellent in "reading the game", highly talented, speedy and anticipating Giuly, especially because Naybet's concentration was below zero...

Exactly one of my points in the game against Monaco, 4 of the goals came playing in outside, our best weapon this season in defense is playing this "old trick", you only need to see the numbers:
in the game against Atlético Madrid we made them fail in 7 offssides, against Barca it was 4, Vs. Valencia 9, against PSV it was 10, in the first game against Monaco they had 13 but, in the last game the number of offsides were only 5 and that's the probe of the lesson of the game: "your old tricks wouldn't work all the time"
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Old 07-11-2003, 23:58   #3
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Hello George! Nice to see you back!! I also like to write lenghty posts which makes us in some way comrades!!

However I feel that I have to comment on few points you made:
1). your comment on our Dms I just can't disagree more vigorously: first of all, Mauro might be old but this does not change the fact that he IS one of the best DMs of Liga_--actually, just as Irureta once point out, there is only Albelda can match( and in my opinion, better than) his class. In deed, it has been my dream to see Albelda playing for Depor but, this will not happen. Albelda is like the Raul of Valencia and he feels that way himself. All the money in the world won't make him change his jersey... And it worries me that we don't have a quality sub for either Mauro or Sergio. Especially Mauro is set to leave Depor when his contract ends this season...

About Sergio--you criticized his defensive ability---all I can say is, yes, that might not be his forte. But Sergio is actually much more of an ORGANIZER than a DM in conventional sense. He is more of the line w/ the like of Guardiola/Baraja/Xavi/X.Alonso...He pocesses an excellent vision of the game and great attacting and assiting ability. And yes, I think( as many other professional sport journalists and commentors do) that he is very talented!! It's a long time I want to state this: because not many in Spain have pointed this out, included that national coach Saez. He is so much better than De Rossi and look at the hype De Rossi gets in my country...if he plays for Juve or Milan he'll get all the hype up...And Not all the DM positions fuction the same especially if you play a double DM system.. You can't deny their ability just for the Monaco game. The fact is that they are the best double duo in la Liga except maybe for Albelda/Baraja...

The Monaco game is NOt the norm for Depor...and the goals leaked mainly were for Irureta's wrong tactical choices and defensive mistakes... Normally either Sergio nor Mauro have too much speed issues...Lack the abilities of reading the game and talents??? Man, you think it's easy to win over Barça and Valencia ??? Man we are talking about some fastest players( Barça) and some most tactical team ( los ches)....And it's not just Fran....actually, to win these team you need to win in the MIDFIELD.

About the selling of Makkay_--I don't think it was a wrong movie. Makaay is a very good striker and had a sensational season but please don't forget: 1) he himself demanded to leave and 2) even he himself admit that his golden boot has to do w/ the support and assits he got from the whole team, i.e. the midfield. It's easy to make a goalscorer a hero but there are few strikers who can score ONLY on personal abilities and sorry but Makaay is not one of them. He is no longer young, had issues Wi the directives and demanded to leave. I don't see why not selling him for real good price especially when the club is in heavy debts... Makaay, I repeat, is very good, and I Like him, but so are Tristan, Pandiani and Luque...

I agree w/ you on M. Pablo( he is not a player he used to be...). And I think Irureta should rely more on the young, MORE PACEY--as you said, and we HAVE them--defense like César, like Capdevila. We might need somone good on the RD position because Hector is far from perfect...but hey, I don't think we are doing so badly in defenders...it's just Irureta should know WHEN to count on WHO...
Depor's administration is actually not so bad. Of course nobody is perfect but within the liga, and being a not-very-rich club I think they actually are doing a decent job...

Personally, I think Depor might have some objective issues and some ambition/mentality issues, which, unfortunately, are not likely helped by purchases---given the fact that either Depor's salary system, nor the media coverage it is doomed( because of RM) to receive in Spain. We can't become a little RM or Barça. We can just try to play good football no matter what and I think most of the time we do. As a fan I understand that it's every fan's dream to see the team of your heart win important titles but more often than not this depends more and more on factors outside the field...
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Old 08-11-2003, 04:35   #4
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Hey guys it's perfectly ok, even welcome, to write "long essays"... but just a tip...

they'll be easier to read if you will leave a line between each paragraph, and divide your "essay" into more "bite-sized" paragraphs. We're reading it on a screen, not a piece of paper...

these essays show that you have adequate access to the games, been attentive during the matches, and actually took time to think through and analyse what you have seen... i like them. keep up the good work!
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Old 08-11-2003, 10:42   #5
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yeh nice work guys - but i have to say this... every team has its ups and downs, we have been in a bad patch lately sure - but when we were playing well the team was not criticised, i mean sure we lost 8-3 - and i have been humiliated by family and freinds but also - before the loss we were winning. I think the team is in ok shape, we just have to concentrate harder!!

i mean the stats are there - the offside trap DOES work, and we have always played it, but we have to concentrate, and we have to make sure that we use it corectly!! but the point about Mouro Silva - i ask someone to find a better defensive mid. he had a shoker vs monaco, but he is our heart in defensive midfeild, the engine in the car if you like....

last year he was leading the stat on winning the ball in midfeild halfway through PL. we need him. and people say that we don't have a backup- i think with experience Dusher is a good option.

in saying that though we do lack depth in our squad. it was exposed vs monaco, but i think if anything we need depth in our central midfeild more to the attacking side. when victor and sergio don't play - lets face it, we suck... there is no attack. Amavisca botched every attack vs monaco.

my point is that although depth isn't there and its good to look at that, we should not criticise too much - i mean we still are 3rd in La Liga...
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Old 08-11-2003, 13:00   #6
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I agree about the all the point above but I think we need a reality goalkeeper also!
Of course Molina is great but his errorous always cost us points in both of CL and Liga. In Monaco game He should be ABLE to save at least 3 goals......
Munua have potential and he may become our future no.1. IF we have to buy a new one, Munua's colleague in NT, Carini may be suitable for us........
OF course we need a young pace defender and DM too but those had been discussed above so i not talking anymore
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Old 08-11-2003, 14:28   #7
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About the off-side traps: It works most of the time but it can back fire as well---especially when you play against teams that clearly received favours from referees, like Real Madrid or teams are ultra-effective and fast in counters!

Our bench depth: It's really much to be desired. We have some qulity subs like César and Capdevila even Scaloni but we don't have subs for Sergio. I'm glad that Anton pointed that out as well! And we need a quality DM to repèlace Mauro after he is gone. Duscher is ok as Mauro's sub but I don't think he can be rely as starting player. Duscher seems to mstake defending/recuperating with fouls!! Which often put himself and the team in unecessary danger.

In my opinion there are some subs in our team are not good enough: for example Amavisca and Munitis---both are very fast runners but that's about it. They don't assist and their attacking abilities are not so good either, and the worst---they are not team players. Maybe Munitis will improve with time? He did well w/ Racing last season... but Amavisca? I am pretty doubtful by now...

About goalie I'm not so worried. We can always take Dani Mallo back!! He is young and full of potential. Munua was too disappointing against Monaco: he made some mistakes that even Barthez at his worst wouldn't have made... I hope he is better than that , otherwise we'll have to look else where for our " future No. 1"!!!

When the winter trasfer window opens we should really look to renforce our right wings and find a decent DM for sub...
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Old 10-11-2003, 05:06   #8
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if we are to buy a goalkeeper - peter Check is a good keeper - i know i spelt his name wrong...

he's young and is a magic keeper!
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Old 10-11-2003, 12:41   #9
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Some of your points are good.But there is one I feel strongly about.Our squad for our size club man for man is still one of the best in Spain if not Europe (except Chelski).We have 2 players for every position. RM and Barca or Valencia don't.Sometimes best 11 yes but squad no.And now a days you have to play with squads.

GK: Molina and Munua
LB :Romero,Capdevilla
CB: Naybet,Andrade,Cesar,P.Amo
RB: M.Pablo,Hector
LM: Fran, Luque
CM: Mauro,Sergio,Duscher
RM: Victor,Scaloni
FW: Tristan, Pandiani,Djalma,Valeron
Then you have Munitis,Amavisca,Jaime ............

90% of those players are or have been internationals for their country so they cannot be that bad.

I agree that maybe Depor should have got some new blood in the summer,But sometimes you have to see what you have and if there is no money then you cannot buy.

Remember we got Djalma,Pandiani,Munitis in the summer and in some way Andrade after his broken leg.

Apart from a mad week of 2 loses and 1 humiliation the squad in my opinion have had a fine season so far.
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Old 10-11-2003, 14:04   #10
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I agree with feliuk.

the balance and unity of the squad is something desired by many clubs.

eventhough there is a need for new signings in the near future,probly next off season,too many elaborate signings will offset the balance of the team.

what i mean is that Del bosque had a boat load of stars and had to pull hair every week for a "good" lineup. players had to play out of their regular, confortable positions to accomodate other stars into the team.This can affect the performance of individual players and more importantly the balance and unity of the team.

Depor is an amazing together team; holding the ball and playing with confidence with very little "world class players".but is still one of the best forces in europe.

2 players for every position is a ggod achieevement and i dont think there is a pressing red-alert crisis for new players.

soon,i am confident that players like Aldo dusher will be more than ready to fill mauro's boots.
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Old 10-11-2003, 23:20   #11
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First of all, thanks for the compliments. Discussions are always constructive in this forum and a lot of you contribute to that. Unfortunately, it seems that some points of my post gave the wrong impression (even if I tried to be as specific as possible, even if I checked it again and again before posting it, as I was aware of its controversial nature). So, to clear all misunderstandings:

1. On principle, "easy" enthusiasms and curses don't work for me. Generally, I'm even more cautious when winning, enjoying but also focusing on visible or potential "systematic" weaknesses. On principle again, indicating (rather than hiding or "polishing") weaknesses at the right timing and trying to influence decision makers on the basis of solid arguments could, actually, provide a good service. During winning phases people don't take seriously your "grumbling and nagging" while after Saturday's match (maybe it wouldn't be too late but) the impact would be different.

2. I do not question Depor's development model. Personally, I was never fond of radical "top down" strategies, while I always respected and admired "bottom up" building team procedures, which is the case of Deportivo (and Ajax, Stutgart, Liverpool in the past etc). So, buying "star players" just like that or transforming into (or immitating) Real M or Barca isn't the issue here. I'm talking about reinforcing the squad taking into account priorities and within the club's limits and transfer funds framework. Which I don't know as Depor (contrary to other big and small spanish clubs) did not spend a single EU in transfer fees last summer (even after selling Makay to which, I repeat, I don't necessarily object). So the question remains: Why does the club have financial problems or even debts?

3. About Mauro (for whom I've expressed my respect in another post) and Sergio: May I say that Mauro is the only player I take it for granted to give all he's got before any game? The second one is Sergio. Their sense of responsibility provides a perfect example to the whole squad. Especially Mauro (as well as Fran) represent all qualities (both inside and outside the pitch) this team is about. But feelings is one thing, judgement is another. I think I'm quite clear in my post about the reasons I feel Depor needs (or should I say needed at least from last summer) reinforcement in central midfield (as well as in central defence area also). And I insist about those needs being top priorities for December! Even if some funs disagree, fact no.1 is that 2 DMCs are a key element to Depor's system, fact no.2 is that after Mauro and Sergio there is ... chaos (hope the best for Duscher but so far..., while Jaime seems not being an option at all).

Overall, I think Deportivo has given (at least to me) the right to have high ambitions and expectations. However, the football universe is becoming more and more competitive every day. My approach takes into account the fact that this team has indeed the potential to give a fair fight in PD and CL given that some preconditions are fulfilled. So give Irureta reliable alternatives. The man has proven he's able to turn the smallest advantage into gold.

It would just be a pitty to see such a qualitative work not reaching justification (in other words, such a team not making it as far as it can get)...
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